So You’re Gonna Be With Family for the Holidays (Episode 1)

Transcript:

[Brent]: Welcome to Life & Love Nuggets.

[Janice]: With Brent and Janis Sharpe.

[Brent]: We want to help you thrive as individuals. I want to help you in your marriages and in your family life. We've been married for a long time.

[Janice]: 44 years.

[Brent]: 44 years. We've been marriage and family therapists for over three decades, almost four, we're sneaking up on four.

[Janice]: Almost, yes.

[Brent]: And we just retired from being pastors of 40 years this last summer. This is why we're actually doing this podcast, because we actually have a little bit of margin in our life for the first time in forever. Today we've entitled this “So, you're gonna go to be with family at the holidays”. Oh my gosh, this last week with my clients, I don't know about you, but several of them and almost every other couple was like “we need to talk about Christmas. We need to talk about we're going to the family and it's always a little bit challenging”.

[Janice]: It really is and I always say every November and December, I spend time preparing my clients for the holidays and then January, I talk them down. So, we really want to talk about just some practical tips and just some things to help people be ready for the holiday, so they can be as good as possible.

[Brent]: Now, most of us are going to spend more time in the next few weeks with family, all bunched up in a little house or even a big house, but way more people than is kind of normal and now, some of you this is a beautiful thing and you're really looking forward to this and it's a really good thing. You ought to be in a Hallmark movie, but most of us deal with some challenges. Even in the best of families, there's gonna be some times, there's gonna be some questions asked or some circumstances or your children are having a hard time in this big group or whatever, that can really bring some challenging circumstances. So, what do we do about that? How do we walk through these challenging times?

[Janice]: One of the things I hear from a lot of my clients is things that are triggered like, immediately over the Christmas dinner table. So, it may be that competitive brother that you have, that starts bragging on his success and I'll have clients say “all of a sudden, I just want to go ‘oh yeah? Well, you cheated Monopoly all the time when we were growing up’”.

[Brent]: Yes

[Janice]: Or an uncle starts on a tirade about politics or how lazy millennials are and you just want to come unglued or I had one and she said-- They would repeat this same story about something stupid she did when she was five and she heard it every single holiday and all over counseling and all of the things she'd worked on, just went right out the window and she went right back to being a child again.

[Brent]: Yeah, yeah.

[Janice]: And I think that's what happens for a lot of people. They end up getting back into childhood issues that they felt that they've outgrown.

[Brent]: So, for most of us, we need some strategies to stay out of these difficult circumstances. So, before we head over the river and through the woods, we're going to talk about some practical things we can do here and by the way, we're not alone in this. I mean, if you look at the scriptural story, I mean, I think “good heavens, there's a lot of challenging families in the scriptures”. I think about Jacob, his son Joseph who was his prized possession and you know, his brother sold him into slavery. I mean, hopefully you aren't dealing with that kind of circumstance, but good heavens, what a troubling family holidays scene.

[Brent]: And what about Jesus? We would expect Jesus has the best and healthiest family and we could model all of our families around his and yet, wow! Tough times. I mean, I remember a time where scripture talks about, he was gathering in a home and a large crowd was with him and his family heard about it and it says they were going to go take charge of him, because they thought he had lost his mind.

[Brent]: And that leads us into the whole section of the scripture where Jesus looks around the table and goes “who's my father and my mother and brothers?” and it's these that are doing the work of the Lord and I don't think he was being disrespectful there; he was just somehow differentiating who he was from everybody else.

[Janice]: And that it's okay to be different, you know? We're going to be with people that maybe we grew up with, but we're very different from them now, because we've made different life choices, a lot of different experiences that we've had since childhood. Now, I think if I had been Jesus in that circumstance, I would have wanted to run out and try to explain to my family “no, really, there's a reason why I'm doing this” or I would have been embarrassed that they were even saying this in front of people.

[Janice]: And of course, most families have someone who will say something like “you're embarrassing us. Jesus, why are you doing this? You're embarrassing us” or “we don't air our dirty laundry in front of other people”. There's all of those messages that come into, but I think so much of our conflict does have to do with our tension, I should say, does have to do with being different and what Jesus is saying to us through this, is it's okay to be different, it's okay to be who you are.

[Brent]: Yeah, what we learned from the life of Jesus is that he didn't allow his family to keep him from being who he was. Even if they didn't understand, even if they were embarrassed, that he knew who he was. I love how N. T. Wright says it this way, because Jesus was moving against some significant cultural standards. I mean, in the Jewish family you did everything together and you would follow in your father's footsteps on what he did and the whole family did this together and so, he significantly was moving away from that and N.T. Wright says it this way, it says “Jesus slices through the whole traditional structure in one clean cut. He has a different vocation; a different mission and it involves breaking hallowed family ties. God is doing the unthinkable, he is starting a new family, a new holy people and is doing so without regard for ordinary family bonds”. So, Jesus is differentiating himself from his family, he's saying “you're you, I am me. That's okay, it's okay for us to be different and have different ways that we do life and ways that we think” and he didn't stop loving his family, but he was separating himself and differentiating himself from them.

[Brent]: Henry Allen has a great quote also on why Jesus was able to love people relentlessly, how he was able to love his family even though they might have been embarrassed with him and people were coming against him and calling him names and attacking him. How he continued to pursue them and Allen says it this way, “it is because Jesus was not dependent on people, but only on God, that he could be so close to people, so concerned, so confronting, so healing, so caring. He related to people for their own sake not his own”. To say it in more psychological terms, he paid attention without intention.

[Brent]: His question was not “how can I receive satisfaction?”, but “how can I respond to your real need?”. This is possible only when there is a deeper satisfaction, a deeper intimacy from whence attention can be paid. Your love for others can be unconditional without a condition that your needs are gratified, when you have the experience of being loved. So much of this our own insecurities start flaring. When we recognize who we are, who've been made in the image of God, that we have value in who we are, not whether our family likes everything that we're doing or agrees with their parenting or this that or the other. But if we have that sense of self and security, then we can go into these family challenging circumstances and be loving.

[Janice]: Absolutely, and we can love the people that are there. I mean, oftentimes we worry about what we think about or what they think about us, but there's also what we think about them. We can choose to be loving and kind towards them, but that means we have to make some decisions and we have to recognize some things. We can't change our families.

[Brent]: What?

[Janice]: Yes, and as much as we would like to sometimes, we can't change them and we have to accept them the way that they are. We can only change ourselves. Oftentimes, I'll have people go “well, I'm not trying to change them or fix them, I'm just trying to help them”. Which is basically trying to change them and fix them and you've just changed the word.

[Brent]: Yes, yes, that’s right.

[Janice]: But we have to let go of that need to make them be who we want them to be.

[Brent]: Yeah, absolutely. So, giving up the need for change. Most of you are familiar with the Serenity Prayer: “God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change”.

[Janice]: Including our family.

[Brent]: Which is most things. “Courage to change the things I can and wisdom to know the difference”. Now, most of us I think, if we're being honest, we go into family gatherings with “God, grant me the ability to change the things I cannot accept”. It's just not what God has given us the power to do, the intentionality to do. It's not what-- It's not how this is going to work. Our families are not going to be perfect--

[Janice]: Neither are we.

[Brent]: What? And so, we have to give up expectations, that things are going to all be different than they have been over the years. I think we go in with these idealistic thoughts that “all will be different this year” and so, “I won't do this or won't do that” and so, we have to expect that things are probably going to be the same and so, what are some practical things that we can do? I feel like you're so good at this and having an understanding of some simple steps that we can take, to help these times be the most effective and the most enjoyable that they can.

[Janice]: Well, I think again it goes back to some of our thought process. We can't fix them; we can't be responsible for them or we don't have to be responsible for them. You know, sometimes when we get with families, we see siblings or even parents or children, grown children, that are making really poor decisions in their life and there's a part of us that really wants to jump in and fix some of that or again, at least teach them. We can't change them, we're not responsible for them, we're not responsible for them to get their lives together or even to come to faith in any way. We can let go of that. We so desperately want to teach people or fix people and I really think that's the holy spirit's job.

[Brent]: But we want to be the-- We want to help the Holy Spirit out, don't we?

[Janice]: I know, but we're really bad at being the Holy Spirit.

[Brent]: We’re bad Holy Spirits. Yes, yes, yes.

[Janice]: I had a parent of an adult child and he was like “I'm really, really not trying to parent them or teach them or anything, but I just know what they need to do in order to have some changes” and I'm like “yeah, that's pretty much the same thing, but it's easy to do”.

[Brent]: If they're six, that's reasonable.

[Janice]: Exactly, exactly. But when they're older than that, no, we need to let them go and be who they are. We also need to remember that we're not responsible for their happiness. It's really painful to see family members that are unhappy and we do, we want to help, but going too far in that, we end up having our sister move in with us and giving her a car. I mean, you could go into codependency with that and you end up losing so much of your life and it's not healthy for her either. So, there's just a lot of things that it's easy to slip into.

[Janice]: We also have to look at-- And I've been hearing this, I don't know if you heard this over and over again, but I'll have clients and they start to set some boundaries with their families over the holidays and then they'll get a call and go “well, Grandma will be so disappointed” or “oh my gosh. Okay, you can do that, but your poor mother is going to really struggle”. You know, sometimes we've almost worshiped family traditions and it all comes to ahead of the holidays, because Christmas especially is so important for so many people and we have to say we're different from our family. We're changing all the time and it's okay to change some of our traditions even in a family, if those traditions are outgrown and they're ending up being more painful for us than good.

[Brent]: Yeah, I think about some of the shaming messages that people deal with from parents or grandparents or siblings and all those things you just said and I think it's the reason we get so hooked in, I think, to shame and “oh, there's something bad about me” or “a good daughter would do this” or “a good sibling or whatever would do this”. Because we've had very powerful people in our life. Again, parents, pastors, Sunday school teachers, coaches, you shame to try to manipulate our behavior and it works for a little bit and it is just not-- It's not life-giving ultimately and so, but any of those kind of shaming, kind of statements, I think just takes us right back to our formative years, when we were shamed into things and it just hooks us and so, we just have to realize that there's a power there, but the more we can acknowledge it, recognize it and push against that, it's going to help us to be the healthiest we can be.

[Brent]: You can love somebody without getting their approval.

[Janice]: Yes

[Brent]: Oh my gosh, we-- I mean, you know, a couple of the main most important things in life on a human level is “I want people to like me. I want to feel they accept me and love me and that my performance, the way that I live is seen as valued and acceptable and successful” and so, we're just really-- Particularly these people, because they're so important in our life, because they've been so powerful and we want them to approve of us. But we have to let go of that, because we're not always going to get approval from them. But we can still love them and we can still know we're okay without getting that approval.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: And also, no matter how much we talk, they're really probably never going to understand this. I see in families they get in these long conversations about things and trying to prove why we think what we think and dealing with such a highly polarized culture where everybody's in camps and trying to prove their point and I mean, you can talk until you’re pink, blue and purple in the face and people are never going to fully understand you. You know, now we-- It's not wrong to give some perspective, but just let it go. Just don't keep trying to convince anybody, they're not going to be convinced in these settings and people will never ever completely understand you. That's just not even possible.

[Janice]: That's right.

[Brent]: Unless we do brain transplants or something, we'll never fully understand each other. That doesn't mean we don't try to communicate and don't try to speak clearly, but we can't put our sense of value in the approval of others.

[Janice]: That's right, and they will never understand us, never completely. I remember a Beth Moore story where she said for the first time ever and she was an adult, but she had a chance to confront the person who had abused her and she said-- She went in and she talked and she said all of those things. All the way she'd been hurt over the years, how it had impacted her, how difficult it was and then she walked out and she turned around the corner and she stood there and went “he didn't get it, he just didn't get it. No matter how much we talk, they may not get it. But that's okay, because even if people don't get it, even if the most important people in our lives don't get it, we're loved by God and he gets us, he knows us” and so, we can hold on to that, even when we're feeling like we're not accepted by somebody around us.

[Brent]: So good, so good.

[Janice]: So, a few practical tips, because I do love to do the practical tips.

[Brent]: Me too.

[Janice]: A few practical tips are, to have good holidays you really have to plan. We kind of have this idea and grandmas are the most-- I think this is the hardest for grandmas and I'm one of them, but I'm a Grammy not a grandma. You have this idea “if I can just get the whole family together in the same house, everything will be wonderful and we're going to have a wonderful holiday”. Well, yes, but again, they're all adults, they all have their own lives and so, we have to make plans that really work for us and where we're at right now. I remember when our kids were little and we would take what was supposed to be a 9-hour road trip, that turned out to be a 12-to-13-hour road trip, depending on where the kids were at that stage of development and we would get to the family's house and there would be all these activities that would be already planned. Which was great, except a lot of them were planned for things that our kids weren't old enough to do or they were maybe too scary for them to do or because they spent, you know, 12 hours in a van packed in together, they just weren't ready to do some of those activities.

[Janice]: And they were with people that they saw once or twice a year, in a strange environment and it was challenging and so, we had to begin, as you remember, we had to begin to say some things like “oh, you know what? The Children's Museum sounds great, but I think our kids are too tired to do that” or “oh, a movie would be really fun, but the baby can't sit still and I think that might be a little too old for some of our kids. So, you guys go ahead and go, have a great time, but we're going to stay here and put everybody down for a nap and we'll meet up later”.

[Brent]: And even if we get eye rolls.

[Janice]: Even if we get eye rolls.

[Brent]: But they don’t understand it or don't know why we would do that, it's okay to say “this is what we feel like is best for our family”.

[Janice]: Exactly, and I think we have to all give ourselves permission for that and that's not just people with kids. I mean, that can be if you're a couple without kids, that can be if you're an individual person. It doesn't have to be oh because we now have kids, we can make changes. I would really rather people enjoy the time together, than to go away going “I hope I never have to go back there again”.

[Brent]: Yes

[Janice]: So, sometimes that means we have to stay in a hotel, because it's just more peaceful for our family or for us as an individual to be in a hotel.

[Brent]: And the family doesn't understand why, because they've made little beds for everybody in different rooms and so forth and they've worked it all out and it's okay to go “thank you so much for that. We just think we're going to grab a hotel” and it’s okay.

[Janice]: “It just doesn't work as well for us, but we really appreciate it. Thank you so much for all the effort that you've gone to, but this is what we think we're going to do” and stay firm with that and with couples, you really need to make sure you're in agreement on that. So, one person doesn't go “okay, mom's going to be so disappointed, do we really need the hotel?”, but make your plans--

[Brent]: Yeah, or in the middle of a conversation and somebody's saying “don't you guys think you could do this?” and if we're not agreed ahead of time, that’s why planning is so important and one of us is caving and going “well, maybe…” and then we look at the other one and put them on the spot and I'm sure this is never-- I'm having a little PTSD, okay?

[Janice]: I'm sure that has never happened to us at all.

[Brent]: We learned most of this stuff the hard way, people, okay?

[Janice]: Yeah, but we say we learned it from our clients.

[Brent]: Exactly, yes. It’s always a good out.

[Janice]: But you know, we can also kind of split the holiday. So, we can spend a few days at grandma's house and then spend a day or two in a hotel, if that makes it more comfortable for us and honestly, we found especially with my mom, she ended up being more comfortable with us staying for a short period of time, because she was--

[Brent]: She was [Unintelligible] for us to go.

[Janice]: She was used to living alone and then we come with four kids and it's like “whoa! This is a lot!”. But we can make plans to make it easier. I think another thing that I liked that we did when the kids were growing up, is sometimes we would stop on the way to visit. So, we might drive to St. Louis and go spend a few hours in the zoo or spend the night there before we would drive on. It made the drive easier, but it also made it so that we had some fun time with just our family and enjoyed that precious time while they were little.

[Brent]: And whatever that costs, I'll just say, it's worth the investment. It helped everybody, our kids do better, it helped the whole package go more smoothly.

[Janice]: There weren't as many meltdowns.

[Brent]: Not as many.

[Janice]: And if you are the parent of adult children or the grandparent, I do think it's really important that you're sensitive to those kinds of things with the kids. I am really proud of the fact that our kids, we have two that live out of town and I'm really proud of the fact that when they come, they go on date nights when they're here. So, that they have some time for just the two of them.

[Janice]: Some grandparents may not understand that, but it's still okay to do, because it's good for you.

[Brent]: Yeah, and this is-- We can spend a whole time talking about the grandparents or the parents, you know? Sensitivity towards families and so forth and that might be a whole another podcast, but some of that is just, be very aware of if you have single kids coming to visit, don’t put them all off on the little singles table or--

[Janice]: Kids table.

[Brent]: Kids table.

[Janice]: Just because they're not married, doesn't mean they need to be with their 9 and 10-year-old niece and nephew.

[Brent]: Or that they always have to, you know, sleep on the sleeper sofa and so, just being “how do we celebrate them and help them feel like they're part and they’re importance here?” and if you do-- I mean, you know, for some it's worth a little bit of the risk of all this, to let the cousins be together and everybody sleep together and so, we're gonna be a little more uncomfortable. It's okay, you know? It's not your bed, it's not your pillow and all. But go ahead and just prepare for that. Again, that's the whole idea of preparation. If the bed they usually put you on is just not very comfortable, take a little extra padding and slip it in there, you know? It might need-- Some of these little white noise machines can be miraculous, you know? To help quiet things and you know, people not be interrupted and so forth and so.

[Janice]: Even bringing water bottles to keep in your room so you can have. Bringing a fan if it's too hot or a sweater if it's too cold. Anything to make it comfortable. I always tell-- You know, I'm involved in mothers of preschoolers and I always tell them “When you go on family vacations, take pajamas that it's okay walking down the hall, because you never know who you're going to run into” or “take a little carry-all for things that you can carry back and forth to the bathroom, just something to make it more comfortable in a very practical way”.

[Brent]: And if your kids have unique food needs, just bring it all. You know, we don't expect them to be aware of those things, right? Those sensitivities and not making a big deal of those special needs, but just kind of make that preparation yourself.

[Janice]: You know, in our family we have a vegetarian gluten-free and low-fat, that's just in our own small family. We just bring food, it's just easier to do that and it does eliminate a lot of stress for the host.

[Brent]: For sure.

[Brent]: So, one thing and I tell you again, we learned this stuff the hard way. Giving ourselves exit points, I was particularly bad at this. We would be in a stressful family situation and Janice is trying to get my attention across the room because something happened with one of the kids or with her or whatever and she's trying to get my attention, so that we could take a break or take a walk or this side or the other and I'd be looking at her going “what?” across the room.

[Janice]: Which is always really helpful, because then--

[Brent]: Everybody else turns to her.

[Janice]: “Nothing. What? Huh?”

[Brent]: And so, just don't let that happen. I'm again, I was not very good at this, but we worked on it.

[Janice]: We did

[Brent]: We had some good conversations after those times and said “okay, how could we change that and fix that?” and so, we had a little-- You know, we might have thought we were a baseball coach or something, we had little signals. You know, pull your ear means, you know, “it's really time for the kids to get a break and I think it'd be great if we took the kids to Starbucks or something” or you know, “spent the afternoon by yourself around”; “I'm gonna-- I need to go take a nap” or you know, those kinds of things.

[Janice]: I teach my clients, those are called “Secret signals”.

[Brent]: Yes

[Janice]: And secret signals always have to be planned ahead of time and really practiced, because otherwise, one's going to look at the other and going “why are you rubbing your nose? What's going on? Are you catching a cold?” or something will happen. So, we have to prepare those things ahead of time.

[Brent]: Yeah, make sure you guys are on the same page and it'll make sure life goes a lot better. We did have kind of one thing signal, that was “if we don't leave in about 30 seconds, somebody's going to die”. So, those are 9-1-1s and so, let me just make sure that we understand what those signals are and it just makes all of life go a little bit better and you can even kind of coach your kids on some of those things.

[Janice]: And it can be really helpful with small children, if you have signals for them or they have signals for you. Especially as they start to get to the age where they might be embarrassed by something.

[Brent]: Yeah, absolutely.

[Janice]: Having those signals really does make a difference and it just helps them feel respected and valued.

[Brent]: Yeah, so they know that they can come in and give you a signal and that means “can you come over here? I need to tell you about something that happened that was hurtful from one of the cousins”. Then it just-- It empowers them, it helps them not melt down and helps us be able to be responsive and nobody's embarrassed, you know, by that.

[Janice]: That's right.

[Brent]: And so, secret signals, all this again, preparing this stuff ahead of time. Another thing is “prepare answers for questions”. There's always these questions that come and if you can prepare ahead and know what you're going to say when so-and-so says this, then it just keeps the stress more reasonable and so, when somebody grills you on “well, why did you get a divorce? What happened?”, it's okay to say “oh, it's complicated. I don't really want to talk about that right now”. It's okay to say that, you don't have to tell anybody anything.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: You don't have to explain everything, but come up with that ahead of time. Now, you may have to say it for a second or third time.

[Janice]: Yeah

[Brent]: “It's complicated and I don't really want to talk about that right now”. “Why isn't your son going back to college?”; “well, he's exploring some other options and you know, he's looking at what he's going to do with his life” and again, you don't have to go into other details, you don't have to explain that he didn't get grades for any of his classes.

[Janice]: “We don't have a GPA for all the money we spent”.

[Brent]: Yeah, we don't have to get into the details, we just have a simple explanation.

[Janice]: That’s right.

[Brent]: You know, “why aren't you married yet?”.

[Janice]: “Because I can't find anybody as wonderful as you, Uncle Harry”.

[Brent]: Yeah, whatever. Yeah, exactly.

[Janice]: Whatever it takes.

[Brent]: And “do you all just not want children?”. Again, have something prepared that you can say. So, you don't have to explain stuff, you don't have to get into those details. Have those answers ready.

[Janice]: Yes. Well, and also realize there may be other people in the family that are going through very difficult times. They may be going through a divorce or they may have had a kid that has an issue. We can step in and help in those particular situations. I mean, sometimes it's helpful-- Not sometimes, it's always helpful to have somebody that you trust, that understands what's going on. So, if you're going to be cornered by this particular relative and they're going to grill you over something and they're just going to push relentlessly to ask questions, that your sister or your cousin or somebody steps in and says “oh, honey, I need you in the other room. Will you help me move chairs or will you help with the mashed potatoes?”, to get you out of that situation and then, we can do that for other people.

[Brent]: Yeah, absolutely.

[Janice]: To me, that's a way we love each other, is to be there to help protect.

[Brent]: So, have your answers ready so you don't get caught off guard and it's okay to simply say to any of these things “I'm just not comfortable talking about that right now” and you might have to say that two or three times. But even the most persistent person will eventually get it and they'll give up and they'll respect that. It's appropriate to set boundaries. A boundary is “this is my space; this is my life”. You are different and it's okay to have a boundary there.

[Janice]: That's right.

[Brent]: Just like we have fences that make good neighbors in our neighborhoods and it's okay to have boundaries.

[Janice]: And we can do that in a loving way.

[Brent]: Yeah

[Janice]: It doesn't mean, which some people encounter when they go to family holidays, “you're crossing my boundaries!”. It doesn't have to be that, it can be “oh my gosh, thank you so much for your concern. I'm not comfortable talking about that” or “I really appreciate your prayers, just keep praying for us. But you know what? I just don't want to talk about that”.

[Brent]: That’s so good.

[Janice]: But it's being gracious and loving in that, because most of the time, 99% of the time people want to know, your family wants to know because they love you and they're concerned about you. They're not trying to make you feel bad, they're not trying to gossip with everybody in the family, though sometimes they do. They're really concerned about you and they love you. So, being gracious to them can be one of the best things we can do.

[Brent]: Yeah. So, it may not-- It may not feel like it or it may feel like it, that you're on trial.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: And it's probably a few circumstances that--

[Janice]: You are.

[Brent]: You are, but you don't have to prove yourself. You don't have to justify yourself. You don't have to explain your life.

[Janice]: That's right.

[Brent]: You have the right to your own privacy and what you choose to share and sometimes our family-- You know, we always encourage people to have safe people in their lives, that they can talk about anything and the people are just like “oh my gosh, I'm so sorry that--” You know, they're so validating and so helpful. They're not trying to fix this and so forth and you know, oftentimes we think “well, that should be family”. Sometimes, but sometimes not. You know, sometimes they're just-- Even though they're family and they're wonderful people and we love them, we go visit them all the time, they're just not the safest people because sometimes they care too much.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: They can't be okay if you're not okay. They have to make you happy; they have to make sure you're happy and they think they know how and so, they relentlessly try to correct and teach and give you guidance and it's okay to go “thank you, but I'm okay. That's all right, I'm working on it” and you don't have to respond to those things.

[Janice]: So much of it has to do with preparing your heart, preparing your mind. Talking as a couple or as a family to figure out what works for you. I think another important thing is we have to give each other or we have to come up with exit strategies. Especially if you are visiting somebody that's out of town and you're staying with them, but even if you're not, even if it's an in-town thing, if things get tense, you need to prepare ahead of time so that if you need to step out for a little bit, you can. So, if you fly into another town, you know, rent a car. It is worth the money if you think that things are going to get difficult and you need to get away. Even if you have kids that need a nap and you're in a hotel, it's good to have that.

[Brent]: Yeah, some of those-- That's what some of those secret signals are for and it's so that we can take a break.

[Janice]: Yes

[Brent]: And it's okay to in the middle of family game night or everybody's doing something, it's okay to say “hey we're gonna take a break and run someplace” and all you do is go and sit at Starbucks for a few minutes.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: It's okay, they don't need to know and you don't have to say “hey, we're going to Starbucks for a few minutes”.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: So, there's not this expectation that you're gonna bring back 20 drinks.

[Janice]: Yes, exactly.

[Brent]: So, and they don't have to know. “Where you guys going?”; “Oh, we're just going to take a break” and maybe all you do is take a drive.

[Janice]: Or go for a walk.

[Brent]: Yeah, sometimes just that little bit of space can help you re-engage, go back and be loving and caring and if you-- If you get enough of that space.

[Janice]: I've noticed that our kids go to Starbucks a lot when they come and stay with us.

[Brent]: They do or they go to all different kind of coffee shops.

[Janice]: I'm just going to assume they love coffee, I'm sure they don't need a break from us. Do you think--?

[Brent]: They are coffee fanatics, sure.

[Janice]: Yeah, that’s what I think. But it is amazing how when you get together with family, difficult things can crop up and you can find yourself getting thrown off a little bit. I remember a client coming into me years ago and she said “you know, I was all prepared with everything that we talked about and I've been doing all these Bible studies and I've been working on really setting boundaries and I was doing great and then we were sitting at Christmas dinner. I'm eating a piece of pecan pie with just a little tiny bit of pumpkin pie on the side, a little bit of whipped cream on it and my mother leans on over and whispers in our ear ‘honey, have you tried Weight Watchers?’” and she goes “there it went, it all went out the window”.

[Janice]: So, part of the preparation is preparing us internally to deal with the things that are going on and as you said earlier, we don't have to have approval and acceptance from family members, but that will be challenged. There will be times where you'll want to go and as my client said, it was “I wanted to go”. “Your values are way off, I'm a wonderful valuable person in spite of my weight and don't you realize how warped that is”. She goes “I can’t say that” and it wouldn't have been right to say that. But it is preparing yourself before you go in, that there are going to be some things that will happen and you won't get your parents approval or you won't get somebody else's approval.

[Brent]: And oftentimes, these powerful people in our life don't even know how powerful their words are.

[Janice]: Exactly.

[Brent]: They don't think that's gonna be so harmful or take you back to being 10 or 15 or whatever and--

[Janice]: Or invalidate all of the progress and all the good things in your life. They really want to help you.

[Brent]: They love you even if their love is not so helpful.

[Janice]: Right

[Brent]: And even if they're still parental and you're 35 years old. It really does come up from a place most often of love. Now, obviously oftentimes it has to do with their own self-esteem and they live their life through you and they need you to be a certain way for them to feel okay about them. That's their issue, it is not your issue and so, don't let it become your issue.

[Janice]: And if we do, if we put so much value in their approval or anything like that, then we'll live with that all of our lives, whether we're with them or not. So, it really involves letting go; “I can let go of this”. Even if you have to sing the Frozen song “Let It Go” all the way there and all the way home. If you really need to let some of those things go, as hard as it is, so you can truly not only be at peace with yourself, but enjoy the holidays and you accept your family for who they are.

[Brent]: Is that why our granddaughters sing that song?

[Janice]: I think so, why--?

[Brent]: Trying to let go.

[Janice]: We're learning a lot, yeah, and you know, sometimes there will even be manipulative family members that will try to say things in a roundabout way. The only way manipulation works, the only way this kind of pressure works is if you buy into it.

[Brent]: That’s right.

[Janice]: So, you really have to opt out when you feel those feelings come up, you have to go “you know what? I'm not going to go down this road, I'm not going to let myself get sucked into this. I'll just go in the bathroom and sing ‘Let It Go’”.

[Brent]: One thing that we found helpful, there's a group of social scientists that talk about a technique called “Becoming a Participant Observer”. That when you're dealing with people that have different opinions or values or even in different camps, you know, we put everybody in camps now. Talking about joining with that group and just observing. I'm going in just to observe, rather than I'm going in to see who's right and who's wrong.

[Janice]: That's good.

[Brent]: And how it relate-- You know, how their opinion relates to my opinion. No, I'm just observing and sometimes, it's a way to kind of disconnect and to then be able to kind of report. The ideas I report, I kind of write a report and give a report about it later.

[Janice]: So, you're emotionally disconnected. You're present there, but you're emotionally disconnected.

[Brent]: No, it’s not a disrespect or it's not, you know, it's not to make fun of the family or to ridicule them, but even to report back. “Gosh, I noticed this. Did you noticed when that happened and then this happened?” and sometimes, that can help provide some emotional safety for us and so, you know, we all encourage-- As we talk about safe people, we all encourage people to have safe people in their lives, to think talk about the deeper things in life and so forth and we all wish that could be family members and oftentimes, it's not. But being okay. So, that's one idea that can be helpful to emotionally distance ourselves.

[Brent]: Another idea they had was to play. They call it “Dysfunctional Family Bingo”. This is, again, a part of preparing ourselves ahead of time. We know that crazy Uncle Harry is going to drink too much, you know that's gonna be a reality and he's gonna say the most inappropriate things. We know that somebody's going to ask “when are you going to get married?”, you know’ We know they're going to talk about “who did you vote for?” and or “Christians certainly have to all the votes for the--” You know, whatever.

[Janice]: And we know they're going to make comments on how you raise your children, if it's different from how they raise their children.

[Brent]: Yes. So, the idea is coming up with all of those statements ahead of time, with little boxes by them so I can bingo, playing bingo. So, we're going in and we're just paying attention, you know? And so, we all kind of have-- We don't have to necessarily have a physical cardboard piece of paper in front of us where we're simply checking off.

[Janice]: Yeah, I don't really recommend that.

[Brent]: You don’t recommend that.

[Janice]: I don't think that'll go well.

[Brent]: Yeah. But keep it on your phone or just do it in your head.

[Janice]: Tight

[Brent]: And when one of those things happen, you go “check, it happened”. Another thing happens, like “well, I was waiting for that one”. So, we go in expecting that and again, we're not expecting it to change or to be different and we're not getting our hopes up and our hopes are dashed, but it also is a way to keep a bit of that emotional distance, where I don't have to be offended by these things. I don't have to go in and change these things. I don't have to go in and “why do they think that way?” and “I need to prove something to them”.

[Janice]: You don't have to go down the spiral.

[Brent]: You don't have to go down the spiral and it's just one of those simple ways that keeps us from getting sucked into that craziness.

[Janice]: I call those “of courses”, with my clients. So, sometimes we prepare ahead of time to go “of course my sister is going to be three hours late to lunch and then complain because the food is cold”. You know, “of course this is going to happen with so and so”. So, you go into it expecting it, but not in a negative way. It's just “yeah, you know what? That's part of the holiday and that's okay”. But I think also being a participant-- Say it again.

[Brent]: A observer participant.

[Janice]: A observer participant, yes. Easy for me to say.

[Brent]: Participant observer.

[Janice]: Okay. I've heard it both ways.

[Brent]: We get it, it doesn’t matter.

[Janice]: Yeah, but part of that is looking for the good.

[Brent]: So good.

[Janice]: You know, it's easy for us to focus on “oh, they're going to do this and they're going to do that”, but we really should look at our family for the good. What are some of the positive characteristics that they have? Even crazy Uncle Harry has some positives within him and people really feel loved and they thrive, when we acknowledge some of the good things about them and in their life. So, you may even with crazy Uncle Harry, it may be-- And don't call him crazy Uncle Harry, because that never goes well either.

[Brent]: No disrespect if there's any Uncle Harry's--

[Janice]: Really, we don't have any on us. But even saying “you know what? It is so impressive that you guys have been able to stay married for 50 years”. Finding good in everybody and encouraging them can be one of the best ways to have a good holiday and everyone needs it. Everyone, as you said earlier, everybody's dealing with their own insecurities and they're coming in with maybe some concerns or expectations over the holidays and if you can be that loving person, it can change lives by feeling like they have that acceptance. You can also do some practical-- Again, I'm back to the practical. Practical positive things like, watch and see if the dishwasher needs to be unloaded. You know, take out the trash, watch your niece and nephew or play a board game with the young kids while other people are visiting. If that makes a difference, you have a chance to really help in the family and bring some positive things and so, look for ways that you can add to the holidays in a very positive way.

[Brent]: Yeah. “How do I serve them?”.

[Janice]: Yes

[Brent]: You know, maybe we provide and prepare a meal and we're not just waiting on, you know, mom to do that or sister to do that and so, how can I serve them in ways so we get our orientation towards “we're here to serve, we're here to love”? If we go on the mission field, we don't expect those people to care for us, we’re here to care for them and so, if we can, you know, we've talked about how do you protect your heart and it's important to be able to do that from-- Because these people are very powerful and they can affect us and spiral off into some negative ways and we do have to orient our thinking right and protect our heart. But how do we give? And if we can orient ourselves towards seeing the positive in them, serving them, caring for them, it just puts us in a whole different frame of mind and even if there's some hardships. We go on a mission’s trip, we expect hardships.

[Janice]: That's right.

[Brent]: And so, there's some hardships, but we're here to love these people and we're here to care for them and appreciate the deposit they've made in us.

[Janice]: Yes. I remember when my mom got older and we decided-- Well, we saw that she was getting very anxious about preparing meals when everybody was coming and so, when we decided we would always bring Christmas Eve dinner and we would always do Christmas morning breakfast and then, everybody would pitch in for lunch and you could just see the relief on her. It made it so she could enjoy the holidays too and to me, that's what's really loving.

[Janice]: The other thing that I encourage my clients to do after the holidays is debrief. Have somebody that you are comfortable with, that you really care about. You know, sometimes it's-- I mean, sometimes it's a friend instead of your spouse, because you've already talked about it with your spouse, but a friend that you just talked through “okay, here's some of the things that we're challenging. Here's some of the things that cause me to question some of my life decisions or some things that are going on in my life” and you can talk them through, talk it through with them to get some perspective on that and then, you can also talk about and you can do this with your spouse as well, “what do we want to do next year to just make things a little bit different?”.

[Brent]: To plan a different thing.

[Janice]: Yeah, “how can we plan?” or “we tried that this time and it didn't work, so what do we do next year to make it different?” and then even reflecting on, you know, “what are the things that I'm trying to change that I just can't? What are the things that I need to accept in my family?” and “how can I continue to love them better, not only through the holidays, but in the time to come?”.

[Brent]: Yeah, the debriefing is so helpful. I think it helps us because in the moment, we may not be able to let go. “I know I heard that podcast and they said I need to let this go and not change people and not take it personally”, but we're caught up in the middle of it, we're in a home that we remember or whatever and it would just, you know, it's bringing back all this, it's just too powerful.

[Janice]: That’s right.

[Brent]: So, maybe it's a week later, a few days later. We sit down with somebody and we talk that through and then, we're able to say-- And we're not looking for them to fix us, we're just waiting for them to hear it and validate it and oftentimes, then we're able to go “okay, I do need to let that go. I know that I'm not-- You know, they're the same person they always have been and it's probably going to happen next year again, but I need to let that go”.

[Janice]: Yes

[Brent]: And so, as we go into the holidays, first of all, remember everybody you encounter is going through difficulties. They've gone through some pain in their life and some difficulties and hurt people-- Hurt people, you know, it's oftentimes out of their own hurt, their own needs, their own fears and anxieties, that people do need to change everybody or have everybody a certain way and just know that, everybody you encounter is gonna experience that and everybody you encounter is deeply, deeply loved by God.

[Brent]: They are his creation, they are loved by him, they're unique. Ask that God would help you to see their uniqueness and the unique thing that they bring into the world and the way that they represent God and there's parts of them that's a reflection of God in some ways.

[Janice]: And remember, when you're trying so hard to change them or fix them, remember that God loves them even more than you do and he knows them totally and completely and he knows what they need. So, we can let them go, we can put them in his hands and know whether they're your children or your parents or your grandparents or your cousin, he loves them and he's always pursuing them.

[Brent]: Yeah, and if they do need to change, he knows how to move towards them and move them towards change, that's not our responsibility and so, this is potentially the most wonderful time of the year and so, that's it for now.

[Janice]: We pray that you have a very wonderful imperfect perfect Christmas.

[Brent]: Yes, absolutely. Blessings as you go forward in your journey.

The Life & Love Nuggets podcast should not be considered or used for counseling but for educational purposes only.